City of Amnesia

I have been a long time fan of the Big o Anime series like many of you,and I have read many of the forums and websites about trying to get a season 3 for the Big O
and I was currently wondering what is going on as far as getting a S-3 of The Big O?

Also if you can explain as to who I can contact or recommend sending letters to about the Big O S-3 with Ideas that would be great.

Does anyone know to when Savebigo.com
will be back up and running?



Sincerly
Roger Smith

Well, as far as I know AS and CN have said about 3000 times in the past that a third season isn't planned at all. The usual excuse they give is it had "low ratings". In short little to no progress has been made.

Yes, Gaddes is right. I doesn't seem like a season three is in production. But to be honest I think Big O got rather high ratings in comparision to most other anime shows on CN. I believe that it's unfair. I think they were expecting Big O to rate as high as Family Guy or Futurama which is extremely unlikely to begin with considering Big O is a drama/anime. However I do remember Big O getting very solid ratings as far as Adult Swim goes. Anyways at least we did get a second season. Who knows...someone could have a change of heart. I really do wish that they would do something for the fans, though. Big O has proven to have a very loyal following.

Ok so Cn studios And A-S are not planning anything currently.
Its been a long time since they aired  the big o on A-swim to.
Ill see what I can think of for Ideas to help.

Big-O's ratings were excellent for an anime, but it just couldn't keep up with Adult Swim's comedy shows. Since Big-O is even more expensive than many of Adult Swim's comedy, they just didn't see any reason to keep pouring money into it.

I think the best chance for Big-O to get a 3rd season is with another network.


I think the Anime Network would be a good choice because they only show anime and would be more willing to spend money on a show like Big-O.

Ok, to try to get a third season, make your own small filmaking company and buy some rights and make a short film. That is all we could do.

Yeah, and if you do that, i want to be the one who plays Dorothy.  :)

I still have hope that CN/[as] will see the light one day. Perhaps if the Anime Legends sets of The Big O sell well enough, Bandai will get a bit more persuasive.

I know it's unlikely, but I'd love to see it happen.

As for SBO (http://www.savebigo.com), I recently talked to another member from there who said that he had talked to Zola, and claimed she had plans to work on the site in the coming weeks. Personally, I've missed the place...

I'm going to be the token asshole here, but I hope there would not be a Season 3.

Start your hating accordingly.
Peace.

That's your opinion. I won't hate you for it, but that doesn't mean I agree with you.

I am curious as to why you wouldn't want to see a third season, though.

yeah, not seeing a Big-O S3 when it actually comes into existence would make my head slpode

Thats like saying you hope the sun rises tomorrow.

;_;

Galatea: Head sploding sounds messy.

Homestly, I think that drawing attention to active Big O forums (such as this fine establishment...  8)) is a step in the right direction.


Also, while thinking of an idea for a spam free "Save Big 0" petition (if you've seen the other, it's heavily spammed), I came up with the following good idea:

1. We could start a thread about sending the userlist of this forum as signatures in a petition for season 3(since alot of us would like that). Then, to be fair, only users who post yes in the thread will get on the list.
2. Big Finale could then, with confidence, send the edited userlist of this forum (minus those undecided or opposed to a season 3) to AS or Anime Network. If needed, a copy could be sent to Lia Sargent as well.

It could work...

.The Final Negotiator.

How trite.

Bad form, Nine, bad form.

We could do this but it would have to be at a later point in time when we have over 5000 members or something.
The downside to this though is the fact that we can't have our comments attached to such a list and also that it would be showing our user name like "RogerSmith236478"

A Season 3 petition has existed for a couple years by now. It has ~3600 signatures. Here's the link:

http://www.petitiononline.com/savebigo/petition-sign.html

...does anyone who matters ever read one of the petitions on that site?

Heh, definitely not.

Man, I remeber doing this back on PCF's in every season three thread. Those where the days.


 But seriously, the main reason a third season hasn't come is mainly AS seems to have moved past anime and on to cheaper comedy shows. It sucks but it's gonna take more that petition with close to 4000 signatures and a small website that sends tomatoes to Atlanta.

What I think has always bothered me about this (apparently I've come back to throw myself over the coals at last) is just that somewhere along the line the crusade for more Big O metamorphosed from the hope and enthusiasm of its fanbase to a full-blown sense of entitlement. Those who say, "no, I refuse to accept it, we should MAKE there be a way, and if Cartoon Network won't provide it we'll badger some other network into coughing up for it!" To be frank, I think there's a reason the people at Williams Street are sick of Big O fans--it doesn't exactly help that the vocal minority is sending trucks of tomatoes to their doorstep.

We are not owed more Big O in any way, shape, or form.

Waitwaitwait, they seriously sent them tomatoes?  I.. I don't know where I was when that happened.  Huh.  

I remember reading something not too long ago that was talking about the sensible way to go about petitioning people for things, and it was saying how when you send crap like that, it's some grunt secretary or whatever that gets your mail, not the actual person you're trying to reach.  So, uh.. if you send a truckload of tomatoes, basically what you're doing is pissing off the messenger and ensuring that what you want to say will never be heard/read by anyone important ever.

I believe they did. Either way, though, I think the tomatoes are just a thing that exemplifies this attitude that I see pervading the portion of the fanbase that really vehemently desires a third season.

For the record, I agree with Xel and Tifaria's positions on the subject, and have no intent of engaging in or supporting what most certainly is a harassment campaign against [adult swim]. Getting Cartoon Network to fund it was a closed street a long time ago.

And I do acknowledge that the people here, at least, seem to be fully aware of that. I still don't think a third season is needed or even desirable for my own reasons--I feel rather strongly about this--but I can at least appreciate that people have decided to go through different channels to accomplish that by now, and the methods that have been suggested here are good ones. I think the ultimate question in the situation, which has historically been answered with a resounding "HELL NO," is this: if those methods prove fruitless, will the fans find the courtesy and grace to cut their losses and accept no for an answer?

Well, yeah, I didn't say I'd be averse to trying to get AN or Lia Sargent's support. Just wanted to make the point that I did.

Personally speaking, I don't really want one, but I wouldn't mind one either. Big O ended on a good note for me, which I suppose is going to make some people go "?".

indeed. I think we all should just be grateful we got a second season. It's true, maybe they did have stuff ready for a third season and AS axed it after the season 2 closing, but I'm happy we even got a second season.

That never happened.  The tomato blitz was planned for August 2005, but then hurricane Katrina hit the Gulf Coast and it was decided that sending a truckload of tomatoes to CN would be inappropriate.  

While I agree that Cartoon Network will probably never fund a third season, they do own the rights to Big O, so any producer who wanted to do a third season would have to go through CN.

I disagree. The thing is that I've ne'er gotten the impression of entitlement from any 'crusaders.' At least from the most of them. There are always a few crazies. Most of the time however, you've just got fans who want to give the show a uh, third chance. Yeah, it's a little unreasonable, but the show didn't do bad at all here in the US. Just comedies where cheaper.


I got the impression that was more of a publicity stunt thing, more intended to catch the eye of the general anime community than anything else. Then again, if advertising SaveBigO on Megatokyo didn't succeed at that, it's probably a crapshoot.

I always figured that the only chance a petition had is if it created a Dilbert Principle scenario and one letter ended up on some incompetent executives desk and viola suddenly it is a HUGE IMPORTANT THING! That or somebody who is rich becomes a fan, or conversely, a fan becomes rich. The former is the more probable I think.

Really, if anythings going to change the mind of anyone it's going to be the sales of the recent DVD re-releases. (If anyone actually thinks the family guy and futurama fan petitions actually made a difference in the long run, please smack yourself in the face until you gain some sense). So if your not broke like me, and reeeaaaaally want a third season, buy out all your copies at a local store and then sell them on Ebay or something.

I'm probably on that 3600 sig petition list somewhere, just too lazy to check it.

I think I may have actually considered doing that at one point...

And ever since then, the effort never resumed. The main reason why Season 3 isn't happening, in my opinion, is simply because nobody with any legitimate authority stepped up to lead SBO in 2006, when the fanbase enjoyed a noticeable renaissance (Big O went back into the AS rotation that year, right?).

As the webmaster of SBO, right now Zola is the leading figure. But she's often condescending, busy with programming jobs or, in her own words, "not that good of a leader," which she's proven in spades. She hasn't even taken any measures to prop up some other motivated, devoted fan into leadership. She's like the Medieval Pope, needed to anoint a king.

But there's been no anointing.

We organized a mailblitz with me leading that, and I managed to scrounge up 30 letters from various fans. But then, with my standards too high, and having nobody tell me to just send what we've got already (Zola could've done that, anybody could've), time passed and Jim Samples (to whom we addressed the letters) resigned (replaced by Stuart Snyder).

But that makes me wonder. Huh. Why don't I just scan all the signatures, change the names on the letters, and send them now, even though it's pretty late?

What do you think? Do I have some support? It is just ~30, BUT that's much more than 0.

Now, Gaddes and Citizen 9, I know what you think. I'm interested in what the other fans have to say. If just a few of you lend your support, I'd be thoroughly motivated to put the plan into action. I'd even make a video recording as satisfying proof.

After following this thread, I'm now not sure which group I fall into...

Like Big Finale, I think the series ended on a good note. However, I do want to see a third season Why? The reason is simple: The writer wanted to do a 3rd season... (No disrespect intended, Gaddes - the last episode did bring the series in for a "solid landing".)

Now I've done some (mediocre) writing in my time (nothing published), and I can honestly say that it isn't easy to put one story together, let alone several. Looking at The Big O's two seasons, there were alot of details the writer had to "flesh out", even if you consider the "borrowed" material (in the proper way - in tribute, rather than plagiarizing, other series). So we can only assume that he had put some serious thought into how a 3rd season would play out.

 
So that makes me a "supporter", which I thought I was initially. On the other hand...

- If there is no 3rd season, it won't kill me. Maybe I'll be a little disappointed, but life is full of disappointments, minor and devastating. This would not devastate me. I don't feel "entitled" to anything.

- I won't fight tooth, nail, and tomato for a 3rd season. If you learned anything from this anime, it's "bargain in good faith"... Strong-arm tactics often encounter (and deserve) strong resistance... I will not be a party to any such campaign...

- R. Daniel, I admire your dedication, enthusiasm and resourcefulness, but they're being misused in this case. Please don't stoop to fabricating support for Big O. It will only send the wrong message, and far too many of those have already been sent. For networks, it's better to showcase actual fans of the show, with emphasis on numbers. Loyalty will only get you so far with them. Statistics work better in this case.  ;D:) Now if you have a contact, feel free to send them brief fan opinions, but keep "fanatical" opinions at bay...

- I've seen the petition to which R. Daniel referred. Unfortunately, it's the spammed petition of which I spoke (they must have been very resourceful of spammers, too... :(). Seeing the vandalizing of that petition is what started me thinking about a new petition. One that didn't scream "fan outrage", and instead implied "possible revenue" from a 3rd season. That thinking kind of morphed into a "list of good-natured fans". 8)

- Galatea, you're correct that a list of aliases could be a detractor. I was hoping maybe just the volume of aliases in the list would interest someone. Kind of like saying "Here are a bunch of mature, computer literate people still talking about Big O. Possibly, they have enough money to at least support the sponsors of the show, if not also buy show merchandise." Emphasize the profitability of the endeavor. Then maybe they'll bite... Like a vendor/caterer at a Halloween party - you may not recognize the customers, but you know you'll be paid... :)


So where do I currently stand? Gee, it's starting to rain - I guess I'll stand here...

.The Final Negotiator.

Fabrication? I do have letters--they're just addressed to the wrong person. I feel that, since they took the trouble of sending the letters in the first place, it'd be reasonable to update them.

Although, a couple fans (UK Members) did send me their scanned signatures, for the express purpose of quickly reproducing them.


The letters aren't fanatical. Actually, they're cordial requests, with a logical appeal and a reference to Big O's good television ratings.


Does anybody want me to send the 30 letters, updated?

My apologies... Your "change the names" phrase was a little vague. You actually meant to "change the contact name" on all letters, not the senders' names... I wasn't saying you fabricated the letters. Ummm, yeah you can still send them, but I can't remember if you change the contact name or just send them verbatim with an extra "please forward to" letter attached. I know about forwarding e-mail but not letters. Hey guys, can I get a linguistics check here? It's OK to include the signatures in the letters, too.


Sorry, the talk of outraged fans and tomato-mailings has gotten me paranoid.  :-/  It sounds like you've organized a well thought-out  campaign, and your already one step ahead of me, with polite requests and ratings info.



Yes, if you can, please send them. Hopefully, they don't need "thousands" of signatures, just 30, who could potentially support sponsors and buy merchandise.

Sheesh, now I feel like a jerk... Sorry, R. Daniel. Sorry, everyone. Finale, if you don't mind, I think I'll ban myself this time...  :X *crawls in a hole*

.The Final Negotiar.

Mind you, that actually has happened before.

My own idea's center around building a standard sheet for a paper petition that fans can print up and collect signatures for, particularly at their local Cons, and then scan in for massive damage, I mean, lists of names. As well, joke signatures can be easily cut out in a digital environment before the final petition is assembled. Also: actual paper and pen petitions are actually given some degree of credence. Not as much credence as actual money, but you know.  

The fact of the matter is Big O was on AS, and it is well recognized, and I suspect the average anime fan wouldn't mind seeing more if they knew that there was more to see. The problem is their not going to go out of their way to do anything about it. Not passionate enough. Which is why we've got to bring the stuff to them. Setting up panels at Cons wouldn't be a bad idea either, if such a thing were possible. I dunno the average costs of such a thing.

"So here's this Giant Enemy Williams Street..."

Heh. "No harm no foul," Final Negotiator.

Alrighty, then! I'll send the letters this weekend.

Um yeah. Next Summer, you're coming to Otakon again, and we're doing that. It's friggin' just a half-hour walk from my Haus.

Well I will have to say this. the fact that Mike Lazzlo decided to make Squidbillies and Tom Goes to Mayor with the season 3 cash is a beyond lame.

The fact that I only have a fleeting memory of "Tom Goes...", and no memory of "Squidbillies" (except for maybe on TV listings), show's that Mike's move was not only way lame, but also a waste of cash...

However, I can honestly say that, after seeing The Big O promos (they can still be found online), if I had seen them for the first time, I would definitely check the show out.

.The Final Negotiator.

P.S. I've also considered a side-project to this campaign. Since some of my episodes are taped, I thought of watching the ads (?!? >:( hear me out...), buying items advertised (mostly the inexpensive ones), and then sending either the receipt or a copy of the receipt to the seller, with a letter saying "I bought this because it's ad was during 'The Big O' on Cartoon Network". 8)

   Example: See Wendy's ad for new burger.
                 Buy new burger, and ask for a receipt.
                 Send receipt to Wendy's Home Office, along with your "I bought this because of Big
                 O..." letter.

It could work. At least Big O would be earning them cash again... Alternatively, we could just send the receipts directly to CN.

Hmm, sending the receipts to the companies themselves seems like it would be more effective.

Maybe it wouldn't hurt to send a copy of the receipt to CN in addition, though.

Heh. That's a pretty clever idea. If you made a list of all the things advertised, I'd definitely try my hand at it.

Most of their in house stuff costs practically nothing (squidbillies I know was, the other one I'm not sure of but can't see it being much of a financial drain)

If you want to pin it on any show, the last thing they really picked up which cost alot was the boondocks. Apparently the animation for that was actually pretty resource intensive, and not done by williams street so who knows what other fees were involved.

At least The Boondocks was actually a really good show. Tom Goes To The Mayor was so non-funny that it nearly drove thousands of people to suicide, thankfully it was only 15 minutes long so it ended just as people were finishing up the noose.

30 minutes of look they're sword fighting and saying the n-word

PS: White people, amirite?

Oh yeah, tour de force

22 minutes of social commentary.

As opposed to 12 minutes of random jokes.

I never really cared for The Boondocks but compared to the rest of the AS produced  ??? comedies :-X  it's Shakesphere. 

Well I was really comparing The Boondocks to Tom Goes To The Mayor.

So yeah. watching a dead rat decay in the street is funnier than Tom Goes To The Mayor.

OK, I skimmed through the VCR tape I used for The Big O, and here are the ads that I saw:

stopsign.com (virus protection)
Bleach, Saturdays @ 12:00
Wendy's Burgers
Berries and Creme Starburst Candies
www.Bamzu.com (an online store)
Moral Orel, Sundays @ 12:15
"9 Billion Miles from Earth" (an official adultswim.com video game)
PeoplePC ISP
Vitamin Water (a sports drink)
"JOKE9" cellphone jokes
playphone.com cellphone extras
Harvey Birdman, Sundays @ 11:45
Blockbuster Videos "Total Access" Service (their version of "NetFlix")
Geico.com
Blendy Pens from www.Bamzu.com (1-800-953-2363)
Robot Chicken Star Wars Clips on adultswim.com
Tomb Raider: Anniversary
Dairy Queen Cakes
Boost Mobile
iHome docking station for iPod (www.ihomeaudio.com)


Wendy's burgers, Starburst Berries and Creme, Vitamin Water, and the Dairy Queen Cakes are about the cheapest items in this list that will earn you a receipt.

.The Final Negotiator.

Wow, those products all sound pretty recent. When was the recording made?

"Nine Billion Miles From Earth" is supposed to be a great retro-space shooter game. And from my experience, "Orphan Feast" and "Viva Caligula" are quite fun (two more recent original [as] games).

As far as The Boondocks is concerned... I haven't found my self too excited about the new season. Sure, the first had it's fair share of hilarious "antics," but I just don't see myself tuning in. I dunno, maybe I haven't seen what McGruder's got to offer for this new slew of episodes, but personally, I'd much rather watch Blood+ (from what's currently airing on the ACTN block).

I've heard one reason for the delay is that half the animation staff just got fed up with how insufferable McGruder was to work with.

Which really, really wouldn't surprise me if true.

The Administrator of SaveBigO (Zola) may have taken the opportunity to move on to bigger and better things after some jokers did some stuff.

After all, the site sort of became a lame duck as the years went by, and she seemed to feel somewhat harassed or distracted from other activities because of it.

All of the orthodox strategies for getting a third season failed, and now Big O fans have dwindled down to a few and been dispersed to the "four corners of the Web"; I don't think it matters if SaveBigO comes back on or not. It is a site that exists for a purpose, and that purpose seems beyond its capabilities.

I always toyed with the idea of trying to get anime-loving celebreties into enjoying the Big O so that we could have some people with economic-cultural influence supporting the third season movement; Hollywood figures have gotten somewhat interested in video games, and, to a lesser extent, anime, so, "why not?", I asked.

While getting celebreties on board is theoretically the most effective way (THINK SCIENTOLOGY AND TOM CRUISE), accomplishing that is such a longshot it is virtually impossible; I for one wouldn't even know where to begin, except maybe by sending Quentin Tarantino a reccomondation (Big O seems like the sort of thing he would get a kick out of, although I can't be sure of that).

But none of this matters now, as the third season movement is pretty much dead. Heck, it was dead years ago, we just pretended not to notice most of the time.

Actually I talked to Zola last week. SBO will re-activate as soon as I finish the visual theme for the site. Which should be this weekend or next weekend.

Hey, did y'all know that there are oodles of Big O fans in the SomethingAwful forums? Should come as no surprise, I suppose. We should hit that up, pronto. Post a link to the letter drive.

You realize that Scientology fails. HARD. (It's all about the money)... So that's the worst comparison you could make.

Choose better analogies. :-\


Also, I'd just like to say... I still like Big O. I was for a Season 3... still am; but if there isn't one, there's always the Big Oh RPG here. There are other shows with are awesome, but Big O is still gonna be one of my top favorites, and I don't think four years can change that.

That is good news indeed.

What is the SomethingAwful forum?

What I'm saying is, Tom Cruise gives Scientology a lot of money (and appears in public for them, etc) . . . that's the kind of advantage you get from getting the famous/wealthy on board. My analogy was fine. It is an especially good analogy when you consider the implausibility of getting a famous celebrity to join and publically/loudly endorse a borderline cult. So, because getting a celebrity to endorse the Big O third season campaign is implausible, it is an even better analogy.

Anyway, the idea itself is a good one, but I (we) lack the means and methods necessary to make it happen; for that matter, I lack knowledge of the means and methods to make it happen, forget the materials and mediums themselves. Consequently, I lack the will-to-try.

I'm surprised. The SomethingAwful forumers like things? I always thought the entire place was composed of equal parts bitterness and resentment.

I found it here: http://forums.somethingawful.com/

Wow, they ask a $9.95 fee just to register with the forums?!? Finale, you're a saint... ;D Well, R. Daniel, I'll just have to take your word for it.

By the way, I stopped at Wendy's tonight:
- 1 Jr. Bacon Cheeseburger (big win!)
- 1 cup of chili (it's cold here - so big win also!)
- 1 medium Root Beer (Barq's - not just bite, but a caffeine kick to boot! - win)

Add it up and it equals one $4.15 argument to support The Big O.  8) Is it a small amount? Yes, but I'm just one person, so it's OK. Now if I can also track down that DQ receipt, that would be great... ???

.The Final Negotiator.

I'm really not. Something Awful is the exception when it comes to forums, not the rule.

So we know that Cartoon Network owns an option to order an additional 26 episodes (I think it was 26 and not 13, right?).  We also know that the writer of Big O is interested in telling the remainder of the story.  So I have been wondering a couple of things....

1. Does CN's ownership of the option operate like a copyright?  What I mean is, does Cartoon Network have sole ownership of any profits generated from additional episodes of The Big O?  Additionally, is the writer liable for the dissemination of any information related to the continuation of the Big O storyline?

2. What is the duration of the option?  I am guessing that it must have an expiration date like any other option in the business world.

3. I understand that some people have asked the writer about Season 3.  But have they ever asked him whether he is willing to just tell us what the remainder of the story is?  Or do we think he may be holding out with the hope of having Big O picked up at a later date once the option expires?

And one list thing, someone mentioned in an earlier post that SaveBigO.com would be back shortly.  Are there any updates to that timeframe?

The writer doesn't have a sweeping vision for a third season. Just a general idea. He believes if the fans want one, there should be a third season, but he has no power in that department. I can't imagine Chiaki J. Konaka is tripping over his feet to getting back to work on the Big O either. His influence is clear, but I doubt he considers it his finest work.

Still I would take his best guess over Cartoon Network's current ideas for Adult Swim programming. "Perfect Hair Forever"?!? That's one of William Street's "big ideas"? *smashes face on keyboard*