Roger Smith's Age and Origins

[ianfeller]

Now I have been watching for a long time and used to look through all the threads about Big O all the time, but I haven't had enough time to find if these questions were answered. Thus point me in the right direction if this isn't new.


My first question is about Roger Smith's age. How old is he? He looks around the same age as Dastun, and he lived before 40 years ago, so maybe he's in his early 50's in the 'present' so roger would be similar. However before the event he was a major and piloted Big O Because the show is based in reality a 10-15 year old doesn't seem correct, I would say he's like 20 there which would make him 60 in the 'present', but he doesn't look that old I mean Angel still likes him. In addition Rosewater said that he wasn't a tomato so there goes that idea...

Side note: its bothersome that the English and Japanese aren't great matches when reading the subtitles and listening. I found many phrases that were spoken that were clarified greatly by watching the DVD's subtitles, though there are many cases in which the reverse is true as well.

Next in episode 14 when he goes back in time he hold the newspaper which represents the last 'proof' of him being alive after the event. At that point the newspaper flies away and he clearly remembers something and becomes morbid realizing that its possible that we could not be the same person they were before the event because they lost their memories. Then he says that he was actually just a boring person who was raised in an orphanage and then gained an education due to an affluent foster family. Does that actually mean that he actually remembering who he was? He calls them false shackles so and it wouldn't make sense to bring it up if it was part of his life after the event... Also it makes sense that these are all memories because he lost a lot of blood and went into a hallucination which was about his 'previous life'. This also relates to the question of his age...

Now this may just be obvious but isn't it interesting that he was a major and was part of some kind of war and then after he lost his memories he couldn't stay in the military police because he gain any pride working for them? I find the correlation juicy. It also brings up the point of destiny! Despite his lost memories he still was drawn to what he used to do! He continued with his life, his goals and ideas despite not having access to them! Just like Dan Dastun continued to be Major and then Colonel, possibly due to that movie he watched as a young boy.


This is very very out there but is it possible that Roger Smith forced himself to lose his memories because he didn't want to remember that he was in the event as a soldier or whatever..?

Lastly and this is also probably obvious but isn't it interesting that in the bible the messiah supposed to come for 2 reasons either world peace or after a world war that destroys everything. In addition there are many resets in the bible as well Noah and the flood and many more I don't need to list. These resets could be a reference to religion.

Well thats it. I had more, but I can't remember anymore.

[6moondance]

According to those who have read the manga, Roger is 25 years old. 
 
The impression I got from the last Acts of the series is that the same 40 years are replayed over and over with either the same "actors" or their clones.  The cycles began after a catastrophic war which either destroyed everything except for Paradigm City, or destroyed almost everything except for the programmer(s) who created Paradigm City. 

Each cycle is basically the same but with some differences.  In one of the last Acts, Gordon Rosewater states that he hired "a Roger Smith.  The picture shows a much younger Gordon with Roger with domes under construction in the background.  The impression I got was that particular Roger was unsuccessful in his negotiations with Angel and Paradigm was reset. 

   During Season 2, there are frequent references to Roger as an actor.  It begins in Act 14 with several references to Roger playing the role of Roger Smith.  In a monologue in Act 23, Roger wonders if he is "destined to play out the role of Roger Smith in a place called Paradigm City". 

It could be argued that the current Roger Smith is just the latest of many actors to play in this role.  In Act 26, Roger sees an assembly line making mechanical copies of himself.  Is this a hallucination created by a dying brain or a representation of the truth? 

I don't think that's the case, otherwise why would Roger have so many flashbacks and why would he have stated during the final confrontation with Angel that he probably chose not to retain his memories?
   
I recently noticed something interesting in Act 26.  In the ending monologue which is supposed to be a replay of the beginning monologue from Act 1 there are significant differences. 
Act 26:    "My name is (slight pause as if looking for the right words) Roger Smith."  The words 'Roger Smith" are spoken with a slightly ironic tone.
In Act 1 there is no pause and the words are spoken in a matter of fact tone. 

This has nothing to do with the above but has anyone noticed the Easter Eggs in Act 14?  Check out the gargoyle scene. 

[ianfeller]

Yea I have heard that about the Manga as well yet there are many problems with it. First of all it was completed before the second season was set back in motion and thus the stories are only loosely based on what the anime would become. For example Angel Pilots Big Fau and 'the event' is the rain which wipes out everything and explains what is beneath the see and personally I like that idea of the water. But regardless the mention of Roger's age is that he is portrayed to be older in the Manga then meant to and much older in the anime, approx 30 they say in the Manga, but the fact is they didn't know where it was fully going because the show was shortened. No mention of tomatoes is fleshed out, etc so the age could be a beginning change/mistake like creating Electric City then saying that there are no other places for survival, but paradigm. In addition the end of the first season which involves the beginning of foreigners is where the Manga ends, coincidence, doubtful. In addition Beck plays Angel's role in the Manga, odd? Yea that was my rant, sorry.

Next about the Rogers on the assembly line, well whats interesting about them is they aren't really his memories, Big O is showing him this and when I first saw it I assumed they memories seen through Angel's eyes, for he says, these memories you are seeing, they are... You can't mean him, and though it could be Big O, I doubt it. On a side note however I find it interesting that in the end you can't Angel or Roger's eyes, though you can see Dorothy proving that she isn't human. I can't deny or prove anything obviously that is for the next season... If its ever created.

Lastly about the end of Act 26, I don't take any stock into it because thats a falsified ending forced on by CN because the show was being canceled yet again. By allowing a repeat of the first act, but with a different tone as you said gives some, though a poor conclusion. Thats why I prefer the alternate ending from that book.

EDIT: Now for some reason when I was falling asleep i thought of this and couldn't go back to sleep so i decided to post it online. Isn't in possible that the whole Roger Smith's robots on the assembly line, the Dorothy construction, etc. that is Roger seeing from the Megadeus when he's drowning is that the entire world is really set by the director who is Angel? And the reason he is saying NO! is because he doesn't want to believe that free will doesn't exist. It is the classic destiny vs. free will quagmire. But in the end he convinces Angel that despite what destiny there may be it doesn't change the fact that he has to make choices and must live as if there is no destiny because it doesn't matter, life must go on. It's a basic philosophical ideal that its possible that we are all just brains in a vat (David Hume) and we are just believing that we are existing in a certain way, but we actually aren't. (Sorta like the matrix too, but they take the opposite position). But the fact is it doesn't matter cause we don't know the difference and ONLY by NOT KNOWING THE DIFFERENCE or ignoring it we can continue to live our lives. That's the reason Roger Smith gave up his memories so he could live in the present and in the future believing that he is making his own choices even if he doesn't always understand his past. I'm paraphrasing but: The way you were given life doesn't and shouldn't dictate the way you live your life. That's why Gordon Rosewater gave up his memories and why Rosco Fitzgerald suppressed his desire to share his memories until he felt that 'the event' was going to occur again (that's even more an assumption than the other stuff.) ---- Yea so that all made sense in my head, but right now it's 3 AM and i'm tired so i'm going to sleep, but please tell me if that made and sense and/or if i should clarify anything.

[Big Jauln]

Roger's age is a...touchy subject.  Due to the ambiguity of whether there are clone Rogers, whether there was a 40 years ago and the events of 40 years ago actually occured, and due to the inaccuracies of the manga, his age can't really be determined unless somethings are cleared up that we probably will never see cleared.

[Tony Ventresca]

I haven't read the Manga, just watched the television series. Comic book media often stray from their source film media, so I don't see why the Manga has to be considered 100% correct. Anyway, when I watch the television show (which I just started doing again a few days ago) I always get the feeling Roger is too mature to be 25, although I recognize that Japanese pop culture tends to focus on youth, probably excessively, so it's not surprising that Roger is given the age of 25 but the wisdom and physical endurance of a man in his 30s or 40s.